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    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Product # 13683
    $89.99 $99.99 On Sale 10.00% OFF
    6.5in 8in
    In Stock This item will ship on 5/29/2018 if ordered within 1 days 17 hours 42 minutes

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    Model 13683
    Speaker Type 2-way coaxial in-ceiling
    Woofer 8" carbon fiber cone
    Tweeter 1" silk and aluminum dome
    Frequency Response 45Hz ~ 20kHz
    Crossover Frequency 3.1kHz
    Nominal Impedance 8 ohms
    Power Handling Capacity (RMS) 80 watts
    Power Handling Capacity (Peak) 160 watts
    Sensitivity (2.83V) 90dB
    Fs 44.155 Hz
    Re 7.2 ohms
    Qts 0.475
    Vas 39.071 liters
    Cms 601.830 µm/N
    BL 9.042 T
    EBP 83.78
    Xmax 3mm
    SD 21.382 cm2
    Overall Dimensions 12.1" x 12.1" x 4.1" (308 x 308 x 103 mm)
    Cutout Dimensions 10.67" x 10.67" x 3.78" (271 x 271 x 96 mm)
    Weight (each) 6.6 lbs. (3.0 kg)


    Fs = resonant frequency of loudspeaker moving mass (in free air)
    Re = electrical resistance of voice coil
    Qts = total Q of loudspeaker ((Qms x Qes)/(Qms + Qes))
    Qms = measurement of the control from the speaker's mechanical suspension system
    Qes = measurement of the control from the speaker's electrical suspension system
    Vas = equivalent air volume of moving mass suspension
    Cms = stiffness of the mechanical suspension
    BL = motor strength of the speaker
    EBP = Fs / Qes
    XMAX = maximum linear excursion
    SD = surface area of the cone

    Start typing your question and we'll check if it was already asked and answered. Learn More
    Browse 35 questions Browse 35 questions and 74 answers
    Are backboxes available for new construction?
    John M on Jan 4, 2017
    BEST ANSWER: Thanks for the question. We do not currently stock backboxes for this Speaker. Any backboxes that are compatible with the size of the speaker would work however. Hope this helps.
    what are the differences between these and the Alpha series? Do they sound different?
    New User U on Feb 9, 2017
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Black Back Ceiling Speakers 8-inch 2-Way Fiber with Covered Crossover (pair)
    Black Back Ceiling Speakers 8-inch 2-Way Fiber with Covered Crossover (pair)
    BEST ANSWER: Thanks for you interest in these ceiling speakers. Overall tone of the Black Back Speakers will be very similar to the popular Caliber series of Kevlar driver models. Carbon fiber will handle more power before distortion and last longer than Kevlar. Kevlar is better in humidity like bathrooms. The black Back has a protective cover that block debris from getting in to electronics and drivers but retains an open sound. There is no Back can available at this time for the Black Back.
    Is there an install guide for this metal backs? Will these prevent blown insulation from getting into the Alpha ceiling speakers? (I read that one idea is to insert a square of fiberglass insulation batting into the attic, before inserting a ceiling speaker.)
    Tristan R on Feb 27, 2017
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Metal Back Can for 8-inch Ceiling Speaker with Brackets (pair)
    Metal Back Can for 8-inch Ceiling Speaker with Brackets (pair)
    BEST ANSWER: We installed these cans on 16 Alpha 8" speakers, and they're great. See my review there for details. They do prevent blown insulation from getting into the speakers. They also helped with bass delivery, and richness. I removed the bass port on the alphas to take advantage of the cans. A few tips: The cans come with a tiny square of fiberglass insulation, which I can only assume is to smooth out the sound delivery. It isn't attached in any way, and when I first attached the cans to our speakers, it seemed to move around. I threaded the speaker wires through a slit in the fiberglass, and attached it to the back of the can with some gorilla tape so it quit moving around with heavy bass. We also wrapped our cans in Noico, which is like dynamat, as the cans flex a lot with the bass port removed. We were doing new construction, so we wanted to make use of the speaker rings. Be aware that the ring supports are not made for residential construction. They're made for commercial drop ceilings. We had to use an angle grinder to cut off each end of the supports so we could screw them to the ceiling trusses prior to sheetrock.
    Do these work with the 8" Alpha 13683 or the 8" Amber 24435?
    Brian L on Sep 27, 2017
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Installation Kit for a Pair of 8in In-Ceiling Speakers
    Installation Kit for a Pair of 8in In-Ceiling Speakers
    Amber Ceiling Speakers 8-inch 2-way Carbon Fiber with Ribbon Tweeter (pair)
    Amber Ceiling Speakers 8-inch 2-way Carbon Fiber with Ribbon Tweeter (pair)
    Can you aim the tweeters in this speaker like the Caliber series?
    Christopher G on Dec 27, 2016
    BEST ANSWER: Yes, the tweeters can be moved about 15 degrees tilt to any direction. Use the center waveguide ring around the silver silk dome tweeter to position it to your liking. Take care not to poke the tweeters, the inner housing moves fairly easy.
    why do the wires look tiny? should the be at least 14awg like the speakers say is recommended?
    jonathan r on Mar 20, 2017
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Metal Back Can for 8-inch Ceiling Speaker with Brackets (pair)
    Metal Back Can for 8-inch Ceiling Speaker with Brackets (pair)
    BEST ANSWER: Thank you for your question. When it comes to speaker wire there are many different opinions on which gauge of speaker wire to use. We have a guide in choosing which gauge to use for various lengths:


    Although we do not have information on the gauge of the wire in the metal can, the short run from the back of the can to the speaker would not cause issues. I hope this helps.
    says this will work with other speakers of similar dimensions, will it work with
    Product # 13683?
    Kristy C on Apr 17, 2017
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    ABS Back Enclosure (Pair) for PID 4104 8in Ceiling Speaker
    ABS Back Enclosure (Pair) for PID 4104 8in Ceiling Speaker
    BEST ANSWER: The metal 14365 cans WILL NOT work on the 4104 ceiling speakers. The ring is about an inch too wide in diameter for the clamps to work, the can covers the fingers that clamp down on the ring, and the can can only rest on top of the speaker but does not attach (against code).
    Caliber In-Ceiling Speakers, 8in Fiber 2-Way (pair)
    Caliber In-Ceiling Speakers, 8in Fiber 2-Way (pair)
    Building a new house and planning ahead to family room surround setup, an open layout 20x21 room with 3 walls, the 4th is completely open to kitchen. We want minimal clutter and willing to sacrifice some audio fidelity so i'm going for an in-celing speaker setup and using the best bang for the buck (Monoprice) speakers. I like the specs and feedback on this Alpha carbon fiber 8" speaker, however what other speakers would you match it to for a 7.1 setup? I anticipate most of the time we'll use it for 2-ch general tv sound, some for music, and lastly for surround movies. Thx.
    A shopper on Dec 28, 2016
    BEST ANSWER: All of the Alpha series speakers are matched for even sound. Big room should have a big sub.
    Are these suitable for a porch ceiling?
    Chris I on Feb 15, 2017
    BEST ANSWER: I installed two pairs of the 8" Alphas in my living room ceiling and they sound good. I see no reason why they wouldn't work in a porch, but you will need to make sure that there is sufficient space between joists to fit them between joists. That said, I used a pair of 6" Calibers in my porch installation because they were cheaper and because they have matching back boxes. I wanted back back boxes to keep bugs and dust from getting to the speaker. Also, the Calibers have grills that are friction fit, and I wasn't sure if the magnetic grills on the Alphas would agree with changing temps, etc. outside. The calibers sound great with the back boxes on my porch. But I imagine the 8" Alphas would sound even better.
    Hi Dave - it seems you have all the answers regarding the Amber ribbon speakers. Are there any more details you can provide on the upcoming ribbon in-wall and ceiling line? I am mostly interested in dimensions. I have contractors finishing my basement and I getting close to needing to run low voltage and I have already purchased Alpha speakers (13683, 13616, 13618) for my home theater and would like to replace them with these ribbon speakers when they become available - can't wait until October to install though. I have depth limitations for the rear surrounds (3.5" total clearance) which is why I had to get the 6.5" alphas. My concern is that I don't want to have a larger hole in my wall than what the ribbon will need.

    On another note, does anyone use these speakers (15700) as left front and right front speakers? I want to get these but am concerned they will overpower the alphas I will be using everywhere else. It would be great to know all the dimensions (depth included) of the upcoming ribbon speakers so that I can make sure I future proof my setup and have my contractors allow for them. Thanks!
    Nicholas F on May 23, 2017
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Alpha In-Wall Speaker Center Channel Dual 5.25in Carbon Fiber 2-way (single)
    Alpha In-Wall Speaker Center Channel Dual 5.25in Carbon Fiber 2-way (single)
    Alpha In-Wall Speakers 6.5in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Alpha In-Wall Speakers 6.5in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Amber In-Wall Speaker 6.5-inch 3-way Carbon Fiber Column with Ribbon Tweeter (each)
    Amber In-Wall Speaker 6.5-inch 3-way Carbon Fiber Column with Ribbon Tweeter (each)
    BEST ANSWER: The new Ambers are still in development. We have not finalized dims at this time. I am trying to keep the dims similar to the Alphas. 3.5" is my target depth for all of the installed speakers to fit within 2x4 studs.

    The use of the Amber 15700 with Alpha surrounds seems to be a pretty popular formula. If you scroll through the reviews you will see quite a few folks doing just that.
    Should the "vent" cover on the 8" Alpha speaker be removed when installing the back can? Should I also add damping material?
    Brian H on Feb 16, 2017
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Metal Back Can for 8-inch Ceiling Speaker with Brackets (pair)
    Metal Back Can for 8-inch Ceiling Speaker with Brackets (pair)
    BEST ANSWER: If the original design of the 8" Alpha was to have the vent removed if using the enclosures (creating a ported enclosure), it was later changed. What looks like a removable port cover isn't actually removable. In addition to being screwed to the speakers, it's also pretty permanently glued. I played with the enclosures a little before installing them and no matter what I did, the bass was pretty unimpressive. E.G. my 5" bookshelves blew these away bass-wise. In the end, I disassembled the tweeter bridge to seal the hole where the tweeter wire goes through as it whistles quite noticeably once you add the enclosures and sealed the speaker to the enclosure all with household silicone. I also filled the enclosures with additional fiber fill. Hope this helps.
    What range of amp wattage (continuous/rms) do you recommend for each size of these Alpha speakers?
    New User U on Jan 4, 2017
    BEST ANSWER: Thanks for the question. The RMS and Peak power handling capacity is included in the specifications section of the product description for each speaker in the series. for the 8 inch speaker, the RMS power handing capacity is 80 Watts with a Peak Power handling capacity of 160 Watts. Hope this helps.
    I ordered 3 pairs of these speakers. Do I need to order any mounting hardware?
    Robert S on Feb 8, 2018
    BEST ANSWER: I would recommend ordering the metal back cans for them as well. I also ordered 3 pair and had a friend of mine order them as well and installed them for him. The cans will help keep the sound directed towards your listening area as well as protect them from being covered in debris from either your attic or ceiling void, thus making them sound better and last longer. The speakers sound quality is incredible, but you should definitely get the cans. The can installation itself on to the speaker is a little clunky, but, they create a nice, tight seal and fit perfectly.
    What is the cutout size for Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way?
    john i on May 10, 2018
    BEST ANSWER: The Full Specs section of the product page shows the Cutout Dims : 10.67" x 3.78" (271 x 271 x 96 mm)
    What is the maximum thickness of the ceiling that these can be mounted in? My ceiling is 2 layers of 5/8 Sheetrock.
    A shopper on Mar 23, 2018
    BEST ANSWER: It’s a while since I installed. But if it’s too thick then you could cut back the top layer in the area of the fixtures.
    Can these speakers be used for rear speakers for a surround sound?
    A shopper on Mar 20, 2018
    BEST ANSWER: Yes, but I would recommend wall vs ceiling mounting to put them at proper height for traditional rear surround. In ceiling, they work extremely well for Atmos speakers, and if you have to choose one or the other, I'd go Armor if your AVE supports it.
    What would the proper speaker enclosure size be around, if I was building back boxes?
    - Thanks!
    Bart H on May 2, 2018
    BEST ANSWER: We are working on providing complete Theile-Smalls measurements for all of our in-wall and ceiling speakers for building proper boxes. This info should be on the product pages in a couple of months.
    what is the maximum ceiling thickness that the 13683 can be mounted in?
    Charles S on Mar 23, 2018
    BEST ANSWER: I just hung a pair today. I’d say the equivalent of two sheets of ceiling drywall. Could even be a little more.
    How many in ceiling speakers come with it?
    New User U on Jul 14, 2017
    BEST ANSWER: 2 speakers or 1 pair
    what is the purpose of the slot ? are these slots used to direct bass into the room ?
    New User U on Mar 15, 2017
    BEST ANSWER: From my understanding, it's a bass vent. You can use them sealed of vented. If we are talking about the same slot...
    Can I use these ceiling speakers for atmos?
    New User U on Feb 15, 2017
    BEST ANSWER: You could, I think these would be a bit large except in the very biggest of theater rooms.
    What mounting brackets would be recommended for new construction?
    Justin W on Jan 17, 2017
    BEST ANSWER: I didn't use any just the one that comes built in with the speakers. they are butterfly screws and open when you tighten them. just be careful as they are plastic and can break if tighten to hard or fast.
    OK, I have paiinted the grills to match my ceiling. Is the paper-stuff inside the grill supposed to be removed?
    Donald B on Mar 30, 2018
    BEST ANSWER: The speaker can be slightly visible if the thin cloth is removed. Sound is slightly better with the cloth removed. It is completely your option to use or remove. Try both and let folks know your results in the review section of the product page.
    What ceiling speakers are best for outdoors in the humid south?
    A shopper on Feb 8, 2018
    BEST ANSWER: I used these in a boat house & they have held up great.. no issues
    does this one work with alpha and amber series?
    A shopper on Jan 15, 2018
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Alpha Ceiling Speakers 8in Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair)
    Rough-in Bracket for 8in Round Speaker (Each)
    Rough-in Bracket for 8in Round Speaker (Each)
    Amber Ceiling Speakers 8-inch 2-way Carbon Fiber with Ribbon Tweeter (pair)
    Amber Ceiling Speakers 8-inch 2-way Carbon Fiber with Ribbon Tweeter (pair)
    BEST ANSWER: No, Alpha and Amber are too big for this model.
    How do I know how to set the high frequency roll off switch on these speakers?
    Steve L on Dec 3, 2017
    BEST ANSWER: The high frequency roll-off switch is set to your taste. Typically if you have a "live" room, a room with mostly reflective surfaces such as hard floors, lots of glass, and minimal furniture, you will hear high frequencies reflect and bounce around the room. The roll-off mellows the sound to compensate for the extra reflections.
    Would these be damaged if used under a covered porch outside? Moderately humid climate, temperatures from -10 to 100 F
    John R on Apr 1, 2017
    BEST ANSWER: Thank you for your question. The intended use of these speakers would be use indoors. They would not be rated to withstand outdoor conditions. Use outside of the intended purpose would also void the warranty. We would not recommend use of the speakers outdoors.
    What is the coverage angle on these speakers?
    Evan P on Feb 26, 2017
    BEST ANSWER: Thanks for your interest in our ceiling speakers. Most ceiling speaker unless otherwise noted have a 110° conical coverage area.
    4.8 / 5.0
    44 Reviews
    5 Stars
    4 Stars
    3 Stars
    2 Stars
    1 Stars
    Great Audiophile Grade Speaker
    I installed these speakers to replace four Monoprice 6.5 inch speakers that I had previously installed. I'm using the speakers as surrounds and rear speakers in a home theater set up. I also have tower speakers for front left and right, a center channel, and a subwoofer. I was in the market to upgrade my speakers since it appeared that my front speakers were just overpowering the 6.5 inch ceiling speakers I had. I shopped around and I saw these 8 inch ceiling speakers from Monoprice, and it looked like they are from a new line of more premium grade products. The product description looked very impressive when compared to other speakers from high end manufacturers. As usual, the Monoprice price was very competitive. I pulled the trigger and received the four speakers in one box. The packaging was very secure and showed an attention to detail and that you just don't see in this price range. I checked out the speakers and was impressed with the quality of the components and the overall weight, and materials. I enlarged the holes to accommodate the new speakers and found the installation to be relatively easy and straightforward. The only downside was cutting the drywall can be a very messy job, (certainly not the fault of the speakers), and the weight of the speakers made it tough to hold them up with one hand for an extended period of time while the installation screws were tightened. However, I do consider the weight to be a plus in speaker performance and construction quality. I fired up my system and watched some of my reference movies and I was very impressed with the improvement in sound quality over my old speakers. They were much more open and detailed. My wife and I heard sounds we did not hear before coming from the surrounds and rears. So far I am very impressed with the overall sound quality. I can't imagine a better product for the price.

    PROS: Substantial construction quality, Excellent sound!

    CONS: Install can be tough due to speaker weight
    January 19, 2016
    Awesome for whole-house audio
    We've installed 16 of these 8" alphas throughout out home and absolutely love them. A dozen are used in our whole-house audio system using Sonos Connect:Amps. I have 2 pair of these connected to each Sonos. I'm impressed with the deep rich sound we're getting out of them even without adding a subwoofer. The remaining 4 are in the ceiling in our theater room for 9.1 audio. They pair nicely with the Alpha 3-way columns in the walls. A few things we did that I think made a big difference... I removed the bass port plug in each speaker, and added the matching Monoprice metal back cans to each speaker. The difference for us with and without was substantial. Once installed, the back cans flexed a lot with heavy bass. To tighten things up, and prevent any rattles or vibration, I wrapped all of our back cans in Noico 80 mil sound deadening mat, similar to dynamat. Overkill? Maybe but they sound awesome, and are rock-solid. And, I was able to do all of our speaker with one pack of 36 sqft of Noico for a couple bucks a speaker. We also sprayed all of the grills to match our ceiling colors. Before doing this, we removed the grill liners that look like dryer sheet. I expect that they would fill up with paint if left in place. After spraying, we re-attached them to the inside of the grills with a little 3m spray adhesive. For those damaged during removal, we replaced them with 'interfacing' purchased at a fabric store.
    The weak spot in these speakers is the plastic tabs, which are easy to break if you're screwing them in with a cordless driver. especially if they're carrying the weight of back cans, or you're dealing with multiple layers of sheetrock in a home theater. Otherwise, these are a can't-lose purchase.
    April 12, 2017
    1 year ago
    Wow....Amazing. DO NOT hesitate to purchase these speakers.
    I looked at these speakers for about 2 months before finally purchasing them. So, to be completely honest, I really thought that Monoprice was deleting negative reviews. But I decided to give the following speakers a try ( 2 sets of Alpha In Ceiling Speakers 8 Inch Carbon Fiber 2-way (pair), 2 Amber In Wall Speaker 8-inch 2-way with Ribbon Tweeter (single), 1 Alpha In Wall Center Channel Speaker Dual 5.25 Inch Carbon Fiber 2-way (single), and 2 Amber 6.5-inch Carbon Fiber 3-way In-Wall Column Speaker with Ribbon Tweeter (each).) I purchased these speakers for a Dolby Atmos Home Theater set up. I have these speakers connected to a Onkyo TX-RZ810 receiver. I cannot say enough good things about these speakers. They are very Crisp, and have a very clean and clear sound. The speakers look absolutely amazing as well. I wish I could upload some pictures to show how well they look. I would not hesitate on purchasing these speakers. You WILL be satisfied.

    PROS: Great Speakers, Great Price, Look beautiful.

    CONS: Shipping is higher than it should be. (Not really a default of the speakers, but I wish Monoprice would have better shipping rates)
    October 1, 2016
    Perfect Addition
    I replaced a pair of bookshelf speakers we have been using with our Sonos Connect:Amp- WOW! That is the best way to describe the difference. Granted a bookshelf speaker and a ceiling mount will sound different, but the quality as compared to cost is impressive. I connected pairs of these speakers in parallel to lower the ohm load to 4 ohms for the Connect:Amp and split them between two rooms- one being left channel the other right- cheap solution to have multi-room controllable sound. Definitely worth the cost and installation was easier than expected, I installed all four in about 40 minutes.

    PROS: Installation and ease of installation

    CONS: None
    April 19, 2016
    Great ceiling speakers
    I have 3 pairs of these in my house, another pair waiting for me to install.

    I started off with the 6.5" Kevlar speakers in my ceilings, which sound good. Then I made the mistake of going for the 8" Carbon Fiber ones. Now I want to swap out my 6.5". They sound much better than the 6.5, on the lower end but I did not install any 8" Kevlar (I have a pair in a box in my garage).

    The spouse insists on a bezel-less speaker, so the Kevlar 8" are a no go.

    These are matched up to Sonos Connect Amps, for streaming music listening.

    PROS: Sound great

    Solid construction

    Ultra slim bezel

    Magnetic grill attachment

    CONS: Expensive if you want to do lots of rooms (and you will after getting them)
    April 25, 2016
    Some other brands sell better speakers in this price range (alpha speakers). They don't mask themselves within 5 feet that well and the bass is so so. these have a tough time filling 10 x 20 foot open area with sound. The 8 inch speakers need 11 inches of cutout. That means you won't be installing different ones in the future without reinstalling lots of drywall. Only takes up to 14 gauge wire.
    July 24, 2017
    10 months ago
    Nice speakers at a nice price
    I give these speakers 5 stars, not because they are the best sounding speakers I have ever heard, they are not, but because they are an incredible value. They can certainly compete with some of the best speakers I have heard. Some reviewers state the the dog ear mounting brackets on these are fragile and break. I had no issues with that and I would say they most likely used a drill instead of a screwdriver. They dont need to be torqued down. Just hand tighten until it feels solid. I used these for a 7.4.4 Atmos install (I like subs) and couldnt be happier.
    February 28, 2017
    1 year ago
    A great value
    I decided to try these out instead of the usual Kevlar 6" units I have been putting into other rooms. These have a very nice frequency range with a better low end than the 6" units even without a box behind them.

    PROS: Price, sound
    September 13, 2016
    Wasn't sure what I would be getting...
    We bought a house that had in-ceiling speakers that had been removed, so we were blessed with having 4 gaping almost 11" holes in our ceiling covered with crummy looking plastic circles. These were one of only three speakers I could find that could repurpose those holes without modification, the other two being speakers costing $500-$1,000... EACH. So the wife said yes to these, and I spent a day putting them up for a whole $180 instead...

    They need some breaking in. The first few days they sound tight and a little too crisp. Like any speaker, really, but I've been running wide range music and movies on them during the day to put some hours on them and get them ready for a more critical listen and I can already hear them warming up. I'm hesitant to use the adjustment on the speaker itself as others have mentioned it having little to no impact so I'd rather adjust using my room acoustics sound data. Part of the issue I ran into is that these were tying to a center channel speaker that is vastly undersized compared to these, but the new center will be here in a few days and that should balance the room better. They put out a lot of sound, and have excellent bottom end reach. You still very much need a subwoofer for movies, but for basic listening they have a great range.

    The quality is good, the mounting feet are a bit sticky and the screws are a hefty amount of turning from being fully applied, which is tough to do while supporting a six pound speaker 10 feet off the ground with one hand.

    I'm very glad I went with these!
    February 28, 2017
    1 year ago
    Best bang for your buck, easy to install, great clarity.
    December 17, 2017
    5 months ago


    In Stock This item will ship on 5/29/2018 if ordered within 1 days 17 hours 42 minutes